I dated Zoe Quinn. I thought she was the most amazing, kind hearted person in the world.
Turns out she was bullshitting pretty much everything I fell in love with her for, and is actually an unbelievable jerk. She lied to and manipulated me for months — effortlessly — because it was not believable that someone could be that selfish of a person, that convincing of a liar, and that good of a manipulator, while completely ignoring the very principles she so adamantly espoused. So I dumped her. Here’s some stuff she did / does in no particular order or tense [which you can verify using the chatlog images in the footer of Act 1]:
- Spend quite a bit of time talking about how she would never ever cheat on anyone because that violates sexual consent — all the while cheating on me
- With Nathan Grayson
- And Robin Arnott
- And Joshua Boggs
- (who is both her boss and married)
- And at least two other people (whose names are censored). And very probably more — but I won’t get into why I believe that.
- As opposed to informing Joshua’s wife, primarily freak out about her own career if his wife goes public.
- Do her goddamn hardest to make sure I didn’t sleep with anyone but her while we were broken up. Inevitably succeed.
- Sleep with a bunch of people while we were broken up, ignoring all of the strong principled stances she used to convince me not to.
- Pretend we didn’t need to use protection whenever we had sex while we were broken up
- or while we were together
- Basically demand I ostracize a friend who was going through some seriously fucked up shit, because that friend had sort of showed a tentative interest in me while we were broken up.
- On her own end though, apparently have no problem choosing to work for Joshua Boggs after cheating on me with him (which I feel requires a bit more than a tentative interest), or after finding out about his wife.
- Spend an hour arguing that she would never lie in a relationship — while she was lying about all of the things in our relationship.
- Stop at pretty much no length to prevent me from finding out the truth. If I had to lose 10 pounds to bouts of panic attacks spent questioning my own sanity for a sleepless week of being ostracized so she could spend that time cheating on me — well, that’s unfortunate for me, but the important thing was that I not be around to make things awkward between her and the flavor of the week.
- Totally make two people up to divert suspicion from the fact that she was fucking Nathan. Seriously, she just — she made two people up. This probably doesn’t deserve its own list item but like, the claim that there were two additional people crashing with her was one of the things that made me think I couldn’t possibly have been right to worry during the panic attack week because who the hell would just fabricate . . . PEOPLE?
- Later go on to ostracize Nathan for a week simply so she could fuck some other guys.
- Have unprotected sex with me like 12 freaking hours after cheating on me with her boss.
- Express remorse really damn well, really damn often, and only about the specific thing she has been caught doing. That is, express no remorse about any of the very related things she hasn’t been caught doing yet.
- Lie in literally the same breath she is expressing remorse about having lied. Which isn’t to say her remorse is fake, I can’t know if it is or isn’t, it sure *looks* and *sounds* real enough. It’s just to say that her remorse doesn’t actually mean anything in terms of future intent. She’ll promise never to do something again in a fit of despair and regret, and then do that thing like an hour later.
- Lie a fucking LOT. Like holy shit how much more can one person possibly lie. At one point she actually lies about a lie about a lie about a lie.
- A bunch of other fucked up things which I’m not even going to bother researching the legal ramifications of telling you about.
- After making a grand show of remorse and expressing a desire to make all of this up to me, go on to ostracize me, because doing the right thing and making it up to me isn’t worth the risk that I might go public with any additional admissions if we have to talk things out online.
- Be really fucking good at pretending to be worth looking up to.
TL;DR of TL;DR: Seriously, you really don’t want to trust Zoe Quinn.
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thezoepost 
Holy. Shit. HOLYSHIT. For reals… holy shit. That girl is a goddamned MESS. I will say that for a relationship that lasted less than a year, posting this blog may be a bit extreme. I will also say that I think you really are trying to look out for other people by sharing all this… a little. I think you may be doing it *mostly* because fuck her, though. It doesn’t matter- if you manage to look out for somebody then I reckon it’s justified. I will also say this: I was with the male version of Zoe for 2 years, and when we broke up, I put him on blast, too. Ran his sorry butt right up the flagpole, with pictures and everything. When you google his name, that shit pops right up. I go back and forth between feeling like having done that makes me better and awesome and feeling like I will never feel better or awesome.
I hope *you* get to feeling better. And you will,,,, time heals all wounds and wounds all heels.
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I had never heard that pun before but I like it.
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Eron, you sound like an emotionally delicate pussy. What kind of man, with an ounce of self-respect, would write something like this?
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TBH Brian having emotions is not being an emotionally delicate pussy. He actually writes it like a diary, which gives you insight into what he was going through. I can tell you’ve never been abused mentally or physically, though, so congratulations on drawing a slightly longer straw than some of us other humans. You definitely drew the shortest straw when it came to genetic predisposition for empathy, though.
With all the lies and deception surrounding gamergate as it is, reading this gives you the perfect context to the entire lie that is Zoe Quinn as a person. She’s a fucking scumbag piece of shit who literally made a political movement out of being called out for being a slut and a fraud. This blog should remain up on wordpress for that simple fact. Anyone who wants to know how big of a crock of shit the gamergate movement was can come here, read the facts and logs and know exactly who Zoe Quinn is.
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Another person posted this but I felt compelled to post it because it’s pretty spot on:
I don’t give a shit about the rest of the gamergate, but the attitude of “well someone fucked you over in a relationship, but you’re the fucking asshole for saying something about it” really pisses me off.
If even half of the shit the ex says is true, and I’m going to think so since there’s transcripts of her stupid ass admitting so, then she’s a terrible person. Not for sleeping around, but for being a huge manipulative bitch and a hypocrite. But everyone is just all, “oh the ex is a ****** and she’s a saint.”
Shit if you want the dick and you want the status then own up to it and be a Samantha. If you want to act like your shit don’t stink though and talk out the side of your mouth then don’t cry when you’re called on it.
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I’m sorry but, none of this is a mature and appropriate way to respond. You do not try and dig up dirt and ruin the lives of your ex. It’s just wrong. Especially when it’s fictionalized, like it is here. Zoe Quinn isn’t manipulative. It’s over. Making her move out of her own home because of death and rape threats is too much. Making this blog was too much. You can’t claim your the good side when you are ruining lives and making stuff up just to hurt people. This needs to end. Take a moment, and think about. You can still make the right choice. You can stopping backing this cause. If there’s nobody spearheading this attack, the attack will stop. Just take it back. Say you lied and that your sorry. Trust me, you’ll feel better about yourselves.
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Everything in this blog is true. Why would I put myself through the legal risk of lying about all of this?
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“Your Conscience” I think its a pretty safe bet that you had your mind made up about this before you came here and had zero intention of giving Eron a chance to explain his side of the story. Also, are you not aware of the fact that he isn’t the only one who’s come forward about Zoe’s behavior? If Eron’s lying then so are at least two other people which would be pretty outlandish.
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I like how they claim that it’s fictionalized when Zoe comes out about cheating in the chat logs in the screen caps and when Zoe and Nathan admit that they had a relationship going on during the break, during which time she was saying not to sleep with anyone, didn’t they?
However, sorry Eron, but your conscience seems kind of dense. I don’t think it understands that the rape threats and harassment came from this blog. Nowhere in here does this blog say to harass Zoe or threaten to kill her. That came from Zoe’s actions, not sympathy for Eron. Do I think that the harassment is good or justified? Of course not. But he’s not to blame for it. The blog isn’t the most mature thing in the world, no. But you can’t claim this is some giant blow to her character. If you want to REALLY hear about her character, ask The Fine Young Capitalists or Wizardchan.
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Or Mallorie Nasrallah.
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there’s clearcut proof she’s manipulative. and proof of this man’s claims. you are clearly a quinn supporter and deecided to take her ‘holier than thou’ stories as fact instead of researching this matter and actually looking at the evidence this guy has put forth. how you can take the word of someone youd admire over screencapped chatlogs and eye witness reports is beyond me
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I don’t think you should have distributed her personal information (phone number, email, real name etc.) In order to let ur anger out. I think you went to far with that. It has resulted in people giving her death threats etc. I symphatize with you, I’m sorry that she has treated you that way, but now you not only ruined somebody who clearly suffers from depression’s life, but also put her life at risk. Did she really deserve that? Remember she is sick in the head and you should learn to forgive but never forget. (Btw you forgive her for yourself, not for her).
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I never distributed her personal information. In fact, I went to considerable length to make sure other people couldn’t determine those. The Boston Magazine article (which I presume is where you got that) is quoting the affidavit filed with the court. Which is stated in a misleading way that can be easily interpreted to mean I posted her real name, phone number, or email.
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Stop making excuses for abusers you wouldn’t make if the abuser was CAMAB.
Sincerely, a feminist.
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I am sorry your relationship went so wrong. I am reading your blog nearly a year after it was written, so I hope you have regained your footing and are well on your way to finding happiness elsewhere.
My father was born in the Faeroe Isles, and he was fond of sharing with me a sentiment that is commonly held there – “No deed should be done, if knowledge of the deed would bring you shame.” It appears Ms. Quinn has many deeds of which to be ashamed. It is a good thing you did by revealing this would-be exemplar for the manipulative, ambitious liar that she is. It’s unfortunate that her association with some good initiatives might have besmirched their validity.
Additionally, I very much enjoyed your writing – it is eminently readable and quite humorous. You should be doing it professionally, if you are not.
Cheers,
Varg
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“I’m not your problem”
Another lie. and refusal to accept responsibility for her shitty behavior. She and her friends have wronged a great many people, and have no shame or remorse. You would have been better off if you had never met her, and your future self will benefit if you never see or hear from her again. You do the world of decent people a service exposing this scum.
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TL; DR- Dont let this experience define who you are in relationships and most importantly do not let her have any impact on your ability to trust women.
For a first love to have been this tragic is something that will inevitably impact your relationships with women further.
After learning this lesson in a similar way to you, I can say that what I have found works best for me is: In future relationships, trust your new partner completely. Do NOT ever let this relationship define all other women for you. IF there is any hard evidence that she has been deceitful or disloyal, simply (not actually simple) walk away. Dont try to fix it….dont try to find forgiveness that will allow you to attempt to mend the relationship….dont take her back. Just walk away. If you are a person that needs closure and the “why” then, which only complicates things, try to get the answer, but for your own personal way of healing and not for reconciliation with her but for your own well-being. Once a cheater, always a cheater and evem though there are circumstances and exceptions the bottom line is that she betrayed the unconditional trust and loyalty you gave her. If she is willing to be disrespect that in the most extreme way possible, then she is not only unworthy of the tears shed and the hurt, but she is also undeserving of the your time, respect, love and presence in her life.
Taking this approach of unconditional trust and respect, I have only been cheated on once and have not once had to deal with the jealousy and unhealthy feelings that the mentality of “I have been cheated on in the past and just want to make sure it doesn’t happen again, so youre guilty until proven innocent” drums up in relationships.
Also, the one girl that cheated on me, she knew and understood that if she cheated I was gone. I guess she didnt believe me because she tried every way imaginable to get me to acknowledge her and accept her apology, but I stood my ground and am happier than ever in a loving relationship while last year she had a baby from a one night stand she had when her husband was out of town.
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This has been my intent since leaving Zoe. But I thank you for the advice and affirmation.
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Wow, real nice, you are a horrible person. You don’t stand by what is going on? Give me a break. Go get some counseling. Jerk.
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ha ha ha how exactly do you do the mental gymnastics after reading this and determine that this guy is the “horrible person”? I mean, if anything, she’s the “horrible person” in the comparative sense, that much is clear.
This guy is still too nice about it in saying that he doesn’t stand by the criticism/”attacks”/”trolling”/whatever that’s been going on and that some people are really getting bent out of shape about.
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how can you be this dense? there is a veritable shit tonne of clearcut evidence of quinn’s sociopathic hypocracy in this blog. but she’s a saint and this guy’s a jerk? YOU ARE RIGHT SOMEONE NEEDS COUNCELING.
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If all of this is true, I‘m really sorry for you. Lying and cheating in relationships is very common, of course, but 5 other guys within such a short time, WOW. However, you probably do not realize that your blog here justifies her deceitful behavior afterwards. Of course, not her cheating. But she was probably always afraid that everything might become exposed to the public, if you find out the full truth. Maybe that is why she has continued to lie and try to hide things. You were just seeing that she acted strange and continued lying, but what she was probably seeing was her whole public image and career in danger. I clearly would not cheat on my partner with 5 other people, but I would also do everything to protect myself from such a thing being exposed to the whole world. And as one can see here, her fear was justified! Perhaps you would have forgiven her, if she had admitted everything honestly, but she didn’t know that for sure, and clearly the danger was greater that everything goes public. If you really want to understand her behavior, then you should think about that.
The best thing you can do is to leave her alone and forget her. I wish you more luck in your next relationship. However, I’d never date a man if I found out he took revenge on an ex-girlfriend by exposing her behavior publicly.
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Her behavior isn’t justified under any ethical system. The correct thing for a good person to do is to not cheat in the first place. Or, if they cheated once, to not keep doing it. And to not affirm that they would never lie when they have done nothing but lie. And don’t even get me started on the gaslighting.
I’m not entirely sure why people get so hung up on my approach though. I’m not the one with 20,000 people looking up to me as a paragon of virtue. And I’m not the one who ties professional and romantic contacts so closely as to be indistinguishable.
You may not agree with my approach, and that’s fine, but I had no other way to warn the people who would unwittingly come to trust her, as I did. Because she isn’t just a liar, she’s the kind of liar who uses people, while claiming to be hyper ethical.
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I just have to say: In most circumstances, I would find both your and her behavior to be reprehensible – but it’s a unique situation when the primary offender is revered as a kind of ethical mentor. In this case, I’d wager to say that you have a moral obligation to expose her.
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wow im a woman and I was just expecting to read a malicious piece by a vindictive jerk. It is not that at all. Its just a person going over a relationship that caused him a lot of turmoil and trying to understand what happened. it strikes me as an honest piece. i dont agree with people threatening violence but I dont think this piece is promoting that. Its just a snapshot or snapshots of what happened. i dont think there is anything wrong with exposing people for their behavoir. I dont agree with death threats or harrassment. but this is not what this is. The online threats of violence are a symptom of something else. Hopefully she learns from her behavoir. Or people should be wary of her.
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Will i be exposed if i am deceitful or can i minimize exposure by being deceitful?
That is the question she seems to have asked herself and i grant that both ways are probably equally likely.
It blew up in her face though.
Decisions, consequences.
The interesting question is whether, if somebody realizes that they are being lied to because the other fears exposure, this should automatically force them to not expose the other person because they would have justified their fears… or whether that is even more manipulative.
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Having myself just recently come out of a relationship where my wife of 18 years cheated on me, i can say that I hope you find your peace, the way this kind of thing can mess with your head is horrible. Your story rings true to me and the parallels between my situation and yours are scary in some places. I believe you, good luck.
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Just wanted to post to say this blog reads like a mirror of a relationship I got out of 2 or 3 years back. I really feel for you man and I also feel for you because of the hate that some people chose to use this post as a justification for spreading.
I hope you don’t blame yourself for putting up with the shit in the relationship. I hope you don’t blame yourself for the shit the came as a fallout of this blog and if you’re ever in the north east of england there’s a pint of your favourite tipple with your name on it.
Best of luck with your future endeavours and relationships man.
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i blogged about you, i hope you will read it: http://zpatriarchy.blogspot.com/2014/08/looper.html
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Thanks for the well meaning advice. However, I don’t have any trouble getting dates. For the most part, they tend to find me, and for the most part, they tend to be pretty good people.
Zoe was of course a horrible person, but given my *general* success, I don’t see much reason to alter my overall approach to dating.
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i’m glad you read it. i had my heart broken 10 years ago & i hope other men learn to spot the red flags that we oftentimes over look. i still hope you will consider changing your approach if you want to create a long-lasting & fulfllling long term relationship. you don’t want a string of relationships like i had.
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Given that you went out on a first date with someone from OKcupid ON YOUR BIRTHDAY, I’m gonna call bullshit. Also you’re how old and never been in love before? And the first time turns out like this? You are clearly doing it wrong. It might be time for a little self reflection.
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We planned to go on dates before. But kept pushing it off.
And yeah, I’m 24 and hadn’t been in love before. I realize it’s weird. But, it is what it is. I don’t know what to tell you.
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Shitting crikey, that’s harsh as fuck, mate. I’ve seen the brunt of a similarly manipulative beast and i can promise you, the hurt does get better. Once you get past the shock and self doubt that arises from such treatment, you’ll piss yourself laughing at the whole thing.
You’ll stand just that little bit taller and enter other relationships with an air of greater confidence knowing you’re not a prick and also knowing what a heart-breaking freak looks like.
in the meantime, keep your chin up, chest out and press ever onward.
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I feel your pain because I dated a compulsive/pathological liar for two years who lied about way more fucked up shit than cheating on me. Those moments of feeling crazy and then finally having to insist over and over just to get them to admit the truth – I have so been there. I understand how much that sucks.
That said, I didn’t even tell most of our mutual friends about all the shit he did (only those I went to for support), let alone destroy his reputation and career. I didn’t try to blow up his life. I moved on and I let him move on, and I genuinely hope he did get help and that he will be a better person in his next relationship.
It wasn’t your job to protect the world against her and sabotage her ability to get her life together. Once you broke up, it wasn’t your responsibility to stay in contact with her or make sure she was going to therapy. Having her lies blow up in her face and losing someone she cared about was the natural and appropriate consequence for her actions. It was spiteful and wrong to post this. Again, I know what fucked up relationships are like and I’m sorry that you were hurt, but you lost the moral high ground when you decided to publicly humiliate her and share conversations that she trusted you to keep private.
At the very least I hope you’ve hurt her back enough now that you can put it behind you and move on.
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I don’t care so much about airy concepts like “maintaining the moral high ground” when there are actual people who will get hurt if I don’t act.
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The next boyfriend of the pathological liar girl I dated committed suicide – maybe I should have warned him.
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Who are you saving exactly? You think she is the only girl to cheat? Become a PI if you want to save every husband or wife that may be with a cheat. You didn’t do a good deed. You did a horrible thing and wrapped it up in a nice little excuse.
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Has nothing to do with cheating. Not that bothered by it. I was even down for an open relationship back near the beginning of the relationship, but she didn’t want one.
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Again, who are you protecting, by airing your dirty laundry and inability to break away from a bad situation with a girl that is clearly dealing with mental health issues? All I see is someone who wanted to hurt someone else as badly and as publicly as possible, not a white knight protecting the populace at large from an insidious evil.
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Ummmm….
Let’s start with everyone who is unaware that this is someone with “Mental health issues” (as you put it) who has the ability to cause severe harm and distress to others who are close to them. Me, I would love to have had warnings about those either undiagnosed, or worse, diagnosed but refusing treatment, because of the harms they caused me while I was undiagnosed, and most likely harming others.
“Hey, look out, that cat has a gum infection, and it’s attacking everyone because it’s in pain” isn’t an act of infection shaming, nor is it a cruel act. Pointing to one’s scratches whilst saying this just confirms that you are speaking your own truth.
Also, just out of curiosity, if she gets a free pass for mental health issues, you don’t see the theoretical possibility that someone who has been through that sort of relationship might not also develop some form of mental health issues? I know my suicide attempt rate rose sharply after the last one of these sorts of relationships I stayed in… So, if she gets a pass, then surely: Doing what one’s own ethical standpoint says is rape, multiple times > Sharing one’s hurt publicly, for reasons one’s own ethical standpoint can condone. So, give him a pass too and go about your day.
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Ok, first telling someone close to you doesn’t end up in a relationship is one thing; telling the entire world is another. To use your cat analogy, wouldn’t the correct response be to post the cat on a blog and tell the world about it’s gum infection? This entire argument doesn’t even touch on the fact that he is letting millions (billions?) of people that will never ever ever come in contact with her know about her transgressions, under the guise that he is protecting them from her. Nor does it touch on the fact that maybe she will get the help she needs, but his decision to create his blog could make it impossible for her to ever break free from the stigma he has imposed. I myself was in a long term relationship with a bipolar girl and it can screw you up, but you know what, at some point you need to find the inner strength to break free and move on. He couldn’t so he destroyed her life instead. That is what I call weakness. Basically, he always had the opportunity to leave his terrible situation, he could delete her information, block her attempts to communicate and move on but instead of moving on he imposed on her a prison from which escape is impossible. In my opinion it is he that should be the leper, not her.
Speaking to you personally, the fact that you mention your suicide attempt rate rose sharply after a poor relationship speaks more to you than your poor relationship. Unless your initial suicide rate was zero, you yourself need counseling and need to learn to love yourself before you can learn to properly love others, or even learn what real love look likes.
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I’m saddened by your response. Some people seem to need to hold to their point, rather than to their own ethics. Actually belittling me for my own psych issues while lambasting another for, in your eyes, being mean to someone else with mental health issues?
In any case, I don’t see how you can downplay the emotional effects of these kinds of relationships on people. Yes, I did have a mental health issue, one which made suicidal ideation part of my background thoughts, and suicidal actions a rarity. Attempts went from a rarity to frighteningly commonplace during and after said relationship. I was also undiagnosed, and had no idea I was mentally ill. With an illness most male sufferers of also have no idea they have. Massively underdiagnosed in men, who make up a disturbing majority of suicide stats. So, maybe this won’t help sane people who won’t take her behavior and lies, and will just leave relatively intact. Or, it could possibly make someone rethink her proposal for long enough to end up getting diagnosed, rather than committing suicide due to the only person to ever tell them they love them repeatedly abusing their trust and sense of self, lying to them, and proudly proclaiming that anyone who does that is a rapist.
Seriously, maybe you missed the part where this guy points out that his girlfriend claims to have raped him repeatedly. If a boyfriend did that, would the girlfriend be allowed to warn people by means of blog post? This is a seriously mentally ill person. It takes serious mental illness to construct one’s morals and ethics to describe rape thusly, then repeatedly do it, then lie to make it not have happened somehow. This is a behavior that, regardless of the internal trauma it causes (and I’ve no doubt it causes her a great deal of pain), also causes everyone within a certain radius pain too. Her, no one can protect, and only she can take the steps necessary to amend her circumstances. Everyone else got this post, and thankfully, maybe one sensitive guy or gal doesn’t end up in ICU or a grave because of it.
But I don’t expect any of that to sink in. You didn’t come here to discuss the issue, you came to make your point, and possibly convince everyone else of it. Part one is done, and personally, part two ain’t happening for me. Too much personal experience with this kind of relationship and with the mentally ill of all stripes. Shit, I’m still having to cope with being unable to live down things I did well over a decade ago. Because I hurt people. Hell, sometimes because I impressed people with my insanity. Either way, they’ll never know who I am now, because that person and their viewpoint are mutually exclusive. This is the thing: When you learn to be okay with that aspect of life as a former mentally ill person, you’re doing well. I’m getting okay with it.
If I were you, and concerned for her wellbeing, then go help her. Get her some help and be a good person. Encourage her to get diagnosed and get therapy. You serve no purpose going off at a guy who, at worst, could be described as being remarkably restrained whilst lashing out at a significant other who caused him serious emotional trauma. SO, once again, if you’ve no interest in helping those who’ve suffered, how about not harming them with your value judgments? There’s a good chap.
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Maybe the whole idea of Eron’s actions “destroying her life and career” would be more powerful… if her life and career were harmed in any way. Her game flopped because, despite the massive victim card played to get it on Steam, it has no gameplay and the story was lacking in what it was supposed to do and people realized that after it went up. Her GameJam is apparently still on the roll too.
Her personal life is apparently still pretty kickin’, if you follow her twitter. Most of the hate she’s getting is less from this post in particular, but all the crap she stirs around on her own. Y’know the crap she stirred with that all men’s forum, the crap she’s currently stirring with 4chan and Twitter and every male out there. The only thing that really sort of stemmed from this whole post is the Gamer Gate movement, which isn’t even about her. It’s about the journalist and this blog is merely used as an example of the dishonesty the journalist put out.
If this post did anything, it boosted support for Zoe among radical feminists who bought that this was an attack on her. It boosted her support from fellow developers and her friends as well for the same reason. In the long term, this blog may not do any more damage to her career or personal life than she’d do on her own, but for the here and the now, the only thing she’s lost out of this is the respect of the honest people and her now ex-boyfriend.
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Who does this help/save? It helped me… I have been in a relationship for about 18 months with a woman that I’ve shared many good times. We had shared love between each other but, when there was conflict and I called on her “half truths”, she would always try to convince me that blue was green and 2+2=3. We played out that cycle for a long time and I questioned my own judgement over and over. With the help of a “dysfunctional family” type counselor, I began to notice the deep seeded manipulation. I began to do additional research how manipulation exists in romantic relationships. That is how I stumbled a cross this site. Although the details are different, the tactics and coping mechanisms Zoe used again and again, were eerily similar. I was stunned how similar and familiar it felt reading this. Before I read this, I began to establish healthier boundaries for myself with her, but things only got worse and worse (when the manipulation was not as effective she relied on her same dysfunctional tactics and coping skills (more manipulation) to try to get what she wanted). I am so grateful to have found this site because it showed me how clear the attempts at manipulation can be once you can see the signs of them. Even then we tried therapy together but she was too defensive to take part genuinely. After reading half of this site (up to when Eron goes back to the hotel because of Zoe’s suicide attempt), I decided to end our relationship. Having now gone through a month of additional difficulties with her and continued communication, I decided to read the rest of Zoe and Eron’s correspondence. I again was helped when I recognized the additional manipulation that was eerily in-common. I have decided to end the ending and stop communicating with her since that seems to be the only way to end her attempts to manipulate. Although, I love her and love the love that we shared, I will not expose myself to this manipulation anymore. I find it interesting that by creating this clear boundary, I am able to feel good about the love we shared without allowing myself to be exposed to the dysfunctional processes anymore. Because I love her, I hope that she is able to find healthier coping mechanism in the future, but I am no longer willing to be anywhere near her while she does (or doesn’t). It is sad, for both you Eron and Zoe, that you both experienced something that seemed so painful. But I thank you, Eron, for sharing your complete experience.
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Yeah, I understand your viewpoint. Her behavior was magnitudes below normal and she was hurting hundreds of others by canceling them with her army of followers. I’ve heard the harassment has even led directly to a suicide or two now. This kind of behavior is dangerous and unethical. Problem is, I can see why some think you’re doing the same thing. I understand this is more like an investigative news article to warn the gaming and charity communities of her abusive and manipulative identity politics and make the rumors facts, and noble as that might be, it might’ve made better sense to edit out the more personal stuff. I applaud you for going after her behavior and for not attacking her as a person so much. It’s a tricky decision to make to do something like this and it probably took you a while to make it. This may have been the only way to expose something this nefarious. Just wish it didn’t make you look so much like her. Now, this has just verified all her worries and validated all her bad behavior. “See! This is what happens when I can’t shut them down!” How does a person operate like that? Present one way, but do and feel the diametric opposite? Mostly, I just hope this somehow leads to her finding the best therapist to assist her in adjusting her priorities and perspectives to something more healthy and humanistic. Shouldn’t take too long to show her how to trust again, excepting all the trauma. That’s gonna take years.
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This is preposterous. ZoePost is not “destroying her reputation and career,” the truth is.
He doesn’t say “don’t hire this person, she is bad.” There isn’t slander here. Rather, he presents evidence and we are left to make the logical inference.
To not tell the truth, to not expose the danger of something is to be an accomplice the next time it happens. It is unknown whether it will happen again or not, but that chance alone justifies the warning of others.
Being silent about it won’t help anyone. I’ll take the ‘truth’ about someone any day rather than all that suffering.
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It is destroying her reputation because he is using the truth to paint her as a slut and compulsive liar who has slept with numerous people in the industry (before that I doubt anyone viewed her as that). Not only is he hurting her reputation, but he also has pulled several others (the men she slept with that he named) reputations down (even worse for the one that is married and named in the blogs). While her game sucked, it is destroying her career because anyone that knows the truth will question any good reviews she gets now as to whether they are legit or just someone she slept with being polite. She is being bullied now on all media and people are boycotting and insulting companies and sites that are connected to the people she slept with because of this blog.
Every story has two sides, but the legal troubles he could be facing is damages due to slander (may be truth, but it is still hurting her reputation), possible cyber-bullying due to the blog, and the publishing of private logs between him and Miss Quinn without her permission. Putting the married man’s identity out there is yet another legal issue as now that man and wife could sue him for damages also for him naming him.
Lastly, you have to remember, he says she lied to him and that at least one of them new about them. The problem is if she lied to him, there is no telling what lies she gave the other men or what lengths she went to in order to have sexual relations with them. This should be all about her and he should have never named the men she slept with in the blog because she could very well have lied to them.
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“It is destroying her reputation” as a pro victim?
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Doesn’t matter what aspect of the reputation he is destroying, still gives her legal grounds to sue him for damages. Assuming they are all in the US, that means Zoe Quinn, Nathan Grayson, Robin Arnott, and Joshua Boggs could also pursue a lawsuit for damages from this blog. Joshua and his wife could also pursue charges due to him announcing his infidelity with Quinn. They could all sue him for defamation of character, Quinn could go so far as to try and get him for cyber bullying due to the reactions people have had due to his blog.
I’ve not looked into it, but I’m sure the husband and wife could pursue legal action too for him airing the husband’s infidelity online to everyone.
Usually, when a person has multiple partners, it is because they are seeking attention, more attention than what they feel one partner can give. All this blog has done is give her that attention and put him in a whole lot of legal liability.
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I appreciate your concern. But unfortunately, that isn’t how the law works. So long as what you’re saying is true, it doesn’t matter how much it damages anyone’s reputation. Aside from revealing classified information, breaching NDAs, or violating medical privacy, speaking the truth is 100% legal.
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I don’t recall from the wealth of evidence on the posts, but did you ever post a message from either Nathan Grayson, Robin Arnott, or Joshua Boggs with them admitting they slept with her? If not then you are slandering them and if this cause Boggs’ wife to doubt him and divorce over it again you would be in more legal liability. That is why I said you should have focused on just your ex, Miss Quinn, and left their names out of it.
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I got to thinking, how do we know it is the truth? You have painted her as a compulsive liar, and people all over the internet have shown she likes to be evil toward people. So how do we know that all of it isn’t her just being evil to you and pulling you along? If she is a compulsive liar then we can’t take anything she said to you in your proof as fact or truth. In trying to prove what kind of person she is, you have in fact gave her the best defense. A compulsive liar always lies, so we can’t really take any of her admissions to cheating or apologies seriously especially since you said yourself you couldn’t tell if her remorse was sincere.
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Right. But it means you also can’t take anything she says seriously. Which still means you shouldn’t trust her.
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That said, I know she was cheating on me for reasons other than her admission of it.
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There is the problem. We can’t believe her or you. You and others on the internet have made out to look like a compulsive liar so we can’t believe what she represents herself as, but we also can’t believe her when she claims she cheated. Unfortunately, we can’t believe you either because we don’t know you. Just a case of he said, she said…or more accurately he said since she hasn’t even bothered to acknowledge your blog or anything you claim from everything I’ve seen on different sites that are talking about this.
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Really? I guess you haven’t paid all that much attention to the early fallout, prior to the total blackout from the entire industry. Remember when the guy from Kotaku’s boss “investigated” it and said they were satisfied their writer wasn’t sleeping with her at the time they wrote an article praising her game? Apart from that being, well, not provable considering what we know from photos published publicly that show the two together prior to him having stated their relationship started. So, at least one has admitted to sleeping with her, but claims they did so after having publicly declared her awesome, rather than beforehand. Cuz payment only ever comes in advance, right?
I’ve been looking at all this for long enough to see all the patterns. If even one organisation or person involved had had the sense to hire a PR professional, then maybe that one actor wouldn’t be behaving in the exact way one expects from those caught with their hands in the cookie jar. That not one person can either clearly refute the claims or actually admit their wrongdoing is a great sign we’re dealing with some classy people…
All except this guy here, who has refrained from making any value judgments (other than measuring someone against their own stated values and asking them how that made them feel), called no-one any names, and I’m honestly at a loss to imagine a world wherein this happened to me and I have any kind of balanced perspective. Meanwhile, the one person everyone IS allowed to judge publicly is this guy. Can’t point out the industry is broken, they shut the threads. Can’t point out maybe a self confessed/described “rapist” could be a less than perfect butterfly or the horde descends upon you with judgments based on, not content, but merely the topic itself. So, who is the one person anyone can judge and find wanting here?
I so love what this world does to whistleblowers, be they small or large scale. When those that did the wrong clam up, the only person left to blame is the messenger. So, enjoy your breif moment of tribal catharsis. You have slain the beast, and can now pretend everything is okay in the gaming journalism industry. These are no longer the droids you’re looking for. Move along.
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The industry is corrupt you say?! Only a naive person would think it wasn’t. Every industry has corruption of some kind in it. The problem is that she could sleep with every reviewer and get excellent reviews, but in the game industry it is the gamer that makes or breaks a game and not the reviews. I have never bought a game based off a review. I’ve played games and liked ones that were bad reviewed games and hated games with good reviews. Most gamers believe reviewers are paid by the game companies to review games anyways and take the review with a grain of salt. It is the reviews by gamers on the sites that other gamers pay attention to (and if you notice on Steam Miss Quinn’s game is the worse reviewed game ever).
As for people saying the good review got her project through greenlight, that is hard considering greenlight is for gamers to vote what they want. Apparently gamers expected more from it than what was delivered and once they got hold of it they let her know how bad it was. Gamers basically vote up or down game ideas and then if it gets so many upvotes Steam greenlights it to be on steam otherwise they move on to the next game.
Corruption in journalism isn’t anything new. Money, sexual favors, gifts, etc. just to get the writer or company to do a nicer article. Been around for centuries. He isn’t whistleblowing because everyone already knows the corruption is there and those who don’t just aren’t paying attention. What do you think the gifts Sony, Microsoft, and Nintendo give companies that review games or the free game copies for them to review are for? Same with the product reviewers on YouTube, half of them get the products they review as free gifts from the company hoping for a good review. Corruption is everywhere and the game industry isn’t any different.
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Yeah, and everyone assumed the US was killing civilians in major fuckups in Iraq, and everyone knew the US didn’t actually think all that highly of the middle eastern dictatorships that they propped up, and everyone knew that the NSA was spying on everyone, and we all know what you did last summer.
What else do we “all know”? What is your assumed baseline of human common knowledge? Can we add “Whenever someone blows the whistle on anything/anyone, there’ll always be smug pricks who both claim to already know these things and simultaneously question the character of the whistleblower.”
So, we already knew you were going to say that.
Now justify having bothered to communicate. Ever. Then, when you manage to do so to your satisfaction, hand that justification to this guy, then sit in a corner and try not to think about what you’ve done.
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The very fact that no one would otherwise believe me is exactly why I offered a ton of evidence. Are you asking me for *more* evidence?
She has checked my blog. And has been monitoring almost everything I do online for the past month. I talked to her a few days ago.
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“I talked to her a few days ago.” are you ready for a new round of mental tortures?
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Evidence can be faked. The fact that you continue to talk to someone you made a whole blog allegedly exposing puts your ‘truth’ in more question. As for faking evidence, took me may a minute to do this to show you can’t take anything online at face value (from a section of https://thezoepost.files.wordpress.com/2014/08/patricia2.jpg I did this http://prntscr.com/4lvx3g ). As I said, we don’t know what kind of person you are and continuing to talk to her pulls this whole blog into question as it is just looking more and more like an ex seeking revenge on his ex girlfriend for breaking his heart.
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Okay, now go ahead and fake the video.
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I feel like you are a brother to me, even though we’ve never met. I had a very similar experience to yours and I’m surprised how well you seem to be. I don’t want to sound douchey, but you had to be a pretty tough/confident guy to survive something like that. I know it firsthand, because I thought about taking my own life after my relationship…ended. It’s been 2 years now, but every time I listen to stories like yours, all the shitty feelings come back haunting me. You probably won’t ever forget what happened, though maybe it’s for the better – it will make you a better person in the long run, though you might experience some…hardcore trust issues. There’s nothing wrong about that by the way.
For a long time I wanted her to stop existing, die, but there was also pity. To this day I think that she was just mentally ill. That’s also what I think is wrong with Zoe. Perhaps it’s a bipolar disorder, or something similar. Or maybe I just refuse to acknowledge that people can be this evil and rotten.
I guess I just wanted to say – it’s devastating to me to hear about your story, because I hoped I was the only one. I hoped no one would have to go through anything even remotely like this. Guess I was wrong.
“You poor, poor man…I don’t want your suffering…”
Yes, I just quoted Charlex Xavier.
Love your jokes by the way. Perhaps you should focus on some form of comedy to stop thinking about all this.
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read most of your story, but had to stop. hit too close to home. was in the exact same kind of relationship with a woman who also lied, cheated and used people while constantly declaring her disdain for liars and cheaters. i always wished i’d written a post like this to warn people of what she was capable of.
you were right to write this story, screw anyone who disagrees!
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Personally, I don’t know you or Zoe Quinn. I do not know if Zoe really cheated on you and I do not even want to know because it’s simply not my business nor anyone elses except your and Zoe’s. However, even if she cheated on you with an entire football team and was antichrist herself, making public accusations like this is simply NOT COOL and NOT ACCEPTABLE. It’s very difficult to see this as anything else than an extreme form of a personal revenge.
For hopefully obvious reasons, I’m always doubtful about public allegations made by ex-lovers. If you are willing to go public with highly personal stuff like this, it is not a huge step to make up accusations yourself. Nonetheless, not matter if you speak true or not, I fear my sympathies are on Zoe’s side. Sorry.
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The post has next to nothing to do with cheating. And of COURSE your sympathies are on her side if you never bother reading the other side :-P. This isn’t about private issues. This is about the extent to which she decieves her fans, coworkers, and lovers about her public stances.
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I hope I didn’t misunderstand you but you seem to openly admit that this was indeed an open attack against Zoe. For me, it is impossible to see how you dealt with this as justified, especially since you probably wasn’t completely unaware what this might lead to.
Also I have special reason to believe that your view about Zoe as her ex-lover may be, well, skewed, I, too, have been there. My heart has been broken by evil she-devils, I’ve done and said things that I probably shouldn’t have but as time goes by slowly start to understand them and their reasons better and I suddenly realize that they weren’t that evil after all. But that’s me and maybe you deal with it differently. Nonetheless, I wish only for the best for both you and Zoe.
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It isn’t an open attack on Zoe. Please just read it. If not the whole text, then at least the logs at the end of act1, act3, and the bottom most tldr.
At one point she openly admits to being a compulsive liar (which is a pretty bad thing for a public figure espousing virtues to be).
At another point she admits to distributing favors and forming alliances for political gain — with vengeance as her primary motive.
At another point, Zoe (who I’ll remind you publicly espouses the importance of supporting people with mental illnesses) demands I ostracize a friend with Crohn’s disease and PTSD who is distraught about her own suicidal friend and losing her job (thereby having no health insurance to cover treatment for her Crohn’s disease), simply because Zoe is afraid this friend (who she has never met and knows nothing about) might try to seduce me.
I left out most of the gaslighting because it was triggering to read through, but even the dulled down references in the logs were enough for abuse survivors to pick up on and freak out about.
This person markets herself as a feminist role model and paragon of virtue. And holds herself to precisely none of the beliefs she espouses. This person is a self admitted compulsive liar, in an industry where business relationships are formed on trust. And if she’s lying about being a compulsive liar, then she just lied about having a mental illness, so there goes her strong principled stance on supporting people with mental illnesses.
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I apologize my unfortunate choice of words which seems to obscure my point. What I really want to know is why do/did you feel justified to make this all public even if you might have been aware that this could cause severe harrassment against Zoe? After you have seen all the mess that ensued, do you still feel you did the right thing?
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Yes, I still feel I did the right thing.
More harassment came out of it than there needed to be, because journalists and devs decided to egg on the angry mob as opposed to listen and discuss.
But for that same reason, a lot of good came out of it to compensate for the bad. Journalistic reforms, >$60,000 donated to TFYC. And heck, even this very blog became extremely helpful to people as a way to come to terms with their own abusive relationships — be they past or present.
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I don’t know if you realize exactly what this did. That big, mutated, ignorant white elephant standing in the middle of the room. What this means for gaming, journalism, geeks…I mean, hell, I feel for you, what a fucked up thing to suffer through. I’m sure a few of us have been through it so your not alone…but on this level? YOU, SIR, HAVE MY COMPLETE AND UTTER RESPECT. You have brought to light something so much deeper, and so much more corrupt then some fucked up little girl. I applaud you, your bravery and your ability to stay cool and collected while your heart was being torn out and stomped on. Geeks will always unite. And her game fucking sucked.
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Again, I don’t condone what she did to you, but I took the time to read every entry on this blog and some things have come to my attention that bother me. You continually say you did this to warn people about Miss Quinn, which could have been done in one simple blog post stating she cheated on you with several people and lied, and not several “Acts” (which makes it seem like a play instead of real life). The other thing is that you went on to name her partners by first and last name and even go so far as to point out one is married. Their names and marital status has nothing to do with protecting people from her. Adding their names turned this into nothing more than a smear campaign.
As for those saying this won’t hurt her “reputation or career” are lying to themselves. You have made it so that now everyone (at least those who know about this blog) will view her as a slut and a compulsive liar. This will call into question everything she has done in her career and if she lied or did something questionable to get the job done. The fact that you had to put a disclaimer about how her and her friends are being treated should tell you right there that your blog to warn is instead being used to bully her.
It wont’ hurt her career? I’ve been a programmer for 20 years and if she approached me to program something for her, because of this blog, I would decline (even if it was a project that interested me) because I refuse to work with someone that would make my wife question my loyalty to her.
Lastly, you are only saving people from one cheater/liar. Every state has thousands of cheaters and liars. At the end of the day, warning the world about one isn’t going to make a dent in the others out there that are like how you painted Miss Quinn or worse because, as you have shown, they are good at hiding it until they are caught and then they resort to more lies to cover it.
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So it is the fault of the person that exposes the liar and cheater, not the fault of the actual liar and cheater that their career/reputation is now damaged?
And it’s not his fault if people use this blog to bully, it’s theirs. It’s a consequence, but he is not to blame for their reprehensible actions based on information provided here. It’s not the peanut’s fault you have an allergic reaction. It’s yours for putting in your mouth and your body for not recognizing a peanut isn’t an evil virus/bug trying to kill you. Stop shifting the blame.
Did Eron do this to give himself some sort of relief or closure? Maybe. I’d say even probable(nothing wrong with that from my pov, Eron, but that’s just me) Can this negatively impact her career? Yes, it can. But how could this all have been avoided? If she had never cheated or lied in the first place, ESPECIALLY after claiming to be a person of high moral character, with clear, unshakable values.
Your post speaks to a larger problem with society today, accepting the consequences for our actions, or rather, lack thereof. It DOES NOT matter if Zoe deserves the more vicious treatment she is getting(she doesn’t). What matters is that she, like far too many today, didn’t consider the consequences of her actions. Had she, and the taken a different course, she would not be dealing with the massive amount of negative attention and would still be in a relationship she claims to have been very good for her. She has no one to blame but herself for this whole ridiculous fiasco.
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Shifting blame? They are both to blame. He can’t even keep his own stories straight.
Several times he brings up her cheating, but told a user in a reply that it wasn’t about her cheating and it really didn’t bother him.
Why bring it up then? “Cause it paints a picture of the kind of person she is.”
Well showing that she made a game about depression and then went and made fun of people at a site where its members are known to battle depression. Showing she signs onto things and then backs out or never shows up. Shows she screws over other groups also paints the same portrait.
He even seems to be telling mixed stories himself as he told one user a few days ago that he has no contact with her, but yet another user that he stays in contact with her and knows she follows this blog.
Consequences? The consequences of cheating is the one you cheat on leaves you. Consequences of unprotected sex is pregnancy and STDs. The consequences of continuously lying about helping and then backing out is that no one will rely on her for assistance anymore.
Your ex creating a blog airing out your indiscretions isn’t a consequence, but rather a very clear act of revenge under the guise of warning people.
If he wants closure then he should have started seeing a therapist to deal with this. As any therapist would have advised against this entire thing on the grounds that it is a revenge blog plain and simple.
Society, yes, they avoid accepting consequences. Though, as I pointed out, this not only has consequences for her, but for Eron as well. As I pointed out, this may end with her being blacklisted, but Eron will be blacklisted too.
Who wants to work with a guy that may air out his team or companies questionable behaviors next time he gets pissed, feels upset, or is fired giving him an emotional justification to make a new blog? This blog will forever hang over both their heads and put concerns into the minds of those that may work with them.
With that I’m going to remove myself from this because it has become painfully obvious that everyone wants to crucify her and praise Eron for his poor choice in dealing with his heartache. I thought he was close to my age, but apparently I’ve led a harder life because if someone had cheated on me, I would have simply dumped her and moved on to find someone better rather than putting this much time into ruining her image.
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He is not blame shifting. I have to admit that is an interesting video and will have to watch the series he made. Clayton Weaver is right, but I think he is just wording it poorly due to not being a therapist. The reason we would have advised against this blog isn’t due to “revenge” as that is subjective to the person reading it, but you both do share blame for two separate issues. She should be held accountable for her actions and deal with the consequences that come from them. Those consequences, as pointed out, was you leaving her, possible pregnancy, stds, and possibly no work. The reason I would have advised against this is because it runs the line of being considered psychological abuse on the abuser. In other words, if she is suffering anxiety or depression due to you making this blog and airing everything, then the abused has become an abuser. Abuse is a cycle that is hard to break, and someone being abused should seek help immediately. Your replies to me, to Clayton Weaver, and to others have sent red flags up for me, I am getting the impression that part of you still wants her (or the illusion she created) even after all of this and if that impression is accurate then I hope you find a therapist in your city to talk to.
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If he did it for revenge, oh well, that his prerogative.
As far as Zoe is concerned, it’s her own fault. She was given every opportunity to walk away with whatever shred of dignity or integrity she could muster, and declined every opportunity.
If the shoe fits, wear it, I suppose.
All things else aside, someone who knows nothing of Zoe or the things she has done, could use this post, the portrait that has been painted, to identify the same kinds of things in their own life. I wish, back at the time I was dealing with the same kind of person, there was something like this around I would have found – it would saved me from a lot of time, money and heartache invested in a situation that ended almost exactly the same way this one did.
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There is a lot to digest in this post–especially form an ethical perspective. Let me begin by applauding you for the rigor of your documentation it is honestly mind blowing and more complete than the 9-11 Commission. Because of that I don’t doubt that you went through this traumatic and difficult experience. I also believe that Zoe Quinn is an inveterate liar which is truly one of the worst things a person can be.
I also appreciate the philosophical acuity of your discussion. You are clearly a person who has given ethical principles more than superficial reflection. Reading the chat logs makes me wonder what depth of intellect Ms. Quinn actually has. Did you ever ghost write for her? Would you admit it? Because I seriously question how deep her intellect is given her amateurish sentences. Everything she writes in those chat logs comes across as a 13 year old’s Tumblr post. Side note–at your first date with her I saw many warning signs of pathological liar. Now maybe it was just the way you composed that story knowing what you know now, but I wonder if you ever questioned her honesty before.
Anyway back to the main point. While I’m not a fan of Zoe Quinn’s work on a good day, and I do feel you were deeply wronged by her actions, I am troubled by the way you exposed her. In my view, it was correct to expose her. She is essentially profiting form an elaborate lie. It’s just the way you did it certainly comes across as excessive. Because you seem to be quite intellectual and I enjoy philosophical discussion I’d like to try and understand why you think your actions are fully ethical.
Let me begin with a simple ethical question: what do you think is intrinsically valuable in the world? (yes this seems tangential, but I’d like to establish an ethical baseline).
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Honestly, I’m not sure which signs in the first date you’re referring to. I wasn’t able to pick up on them. But, I’d appreciate your insight.
I necessarily had to question her honesty during the panic attacks. Because at that point it was either “she is dishonest” or “I am insane.” But she managed to convince me it was the latter.
As for my actions being ethical. I don’t know what it means to be *fully* ethical. An abuse survivor who caught onto this said it best I think. “There’s no clean way to do a callout.”
And that stands true here. There is no way to call a harmful person out without causing some harm, if to no one other than the harmful person. The issue is whether or not the harm you cause is likely to be worse than the harm you prevent. In pretty much all imaginable cases though, any harm caused would end up having benefits as consequences. If for no other reason than that societies are self correcting systems.
To answer your ethical question: I don’t know that anything is intrinsically valuable. I think that things most people want to avoid should be avoided in the long term. And I think that things people view as desirable should be made attainable. But intrinsic value doesn’t make sense. Things don’t have value without people to value them.
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Thanks for replying.
I have not had the misfortune of being in a romantic relationship with someone who turned out to be a pathological liar, so I can’t relate directly to your experience. I have, however, had close friends who turned out to be not as they seemed. One of my closest friends in college turned out to be such a person. When I finally figured it out, things that were said and done in the past suddenly made a great deal more sense. When I said your first date(s) held some signals I was thinking tyo my own experience so I could be a little off base given that the relationships were of two very different kinds.
In any case, what struck me was how self consciously honest she was on your first couple of dates. She emphasized that she was raised by a pathological liar and an ex-husband who gaslighted her (it sounds like). While I don’t doubt that she experienced some of that, I do wonder why she would like to frame her own character in that light. The people in my life who turned out to be pathological liars would frequently do stuff like this. They would draw attention to their own serious fault in another person. My college friend would often do this—usually saying one of her sisters was a “psychopath” or something similar. As it turned out, she was very manipulative and very good at it. Once I started saying no to some of her requests (yes several times for money) I discovered what was really up.
What I was responding to in your account of your first few dates, then, was her heightened self awareness of her own virtues. In my experience, that has rarely ever correlated with actual virtues. It goes back to Socrates’ wisdom “I know one thing, that I know nothing”. I’m not saying I expect everyone to be self deprecating Socratic intellectualists, but I think you know what I mean. Why not just talk about who she is without framing it in the context of past lying/gaslighting? Like I said, I don’t doubt she had some issues in her past and with her ex, but knowing what we know now you have to suspect some of it was embellished or “mis-remembered”.
As for value—I think that’s a valid position. Namely, that there is nothing to value in the world without people to value it. That being said, I do think you can give an objective account of value while recognizing the subjective character of valuing. So, for example, we might declare that pleasure is the only intrinsically valuable thing in the universe (ala Bentham) even if that is a subjective state. I guess the next question would be—how do you establish that as an objective truth? I think we could appeal to reason here and give a basic argument showing that pleasure is the only thing we all hold in common etc etc.
The reason I asked that question, I guess, is to see what you think the aim of ethical behavior should be. That is, what makes something right as opposed to wrong. Again, I actually think that your exposing of Zoe Quinn was a valuable service to society, I’m just hazy on the ethical principle guiding the decision to be as extensive was you were.
**All that being said, it’s silly to suggest your posting is in anyway misogynistic. In fact, it takes great pains to be the opposite of that. You never hint or suggest that Zoe’s fickleness is related to her gender etc. It’s pretty obvious what you’ve written here is an expose on one person’s extensive web of lies. If the posting is inappropriate, it is so because it exposes messages that were meant to be private and perhaps to a gratuitous degree.
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Haha. Yeah I get the “private and gratuitous” critique a lot. And that’s probably fair to some extent. But, I think people would probably change their mind if they knew the things I chose *not* to reveal.
I like Bentham, and I used to agree with him in my youth. But the more I learn about neurology the less I’m able to reconcile the position that pleasure is the valuable state. What seems to be closer to the truth, is that “hope” is the valuable state. The yearning for pleasure, which is roughly assured to be achievable. I mean, hedonism is great, but it’s not really how brains work. They always adjust to any state of happiness such that it becomes the baseline. At which point, you have a world filled with wonderful things, which ultimately no one really appreciates.
Anyway, most of my ethical decisions are roughly guided from a negative utilitarian standpoint. That is, be less concerned with maximizing the overall happiness people experience, and more concerned with minimizing the overall harm. Which on one hand might make the post seem antithetical to my goals, but less so if you know Zoe. And more importantly, the huge majority of expected developments which would have caused short term harm were all made up for by the likelihood of the system repairing its self in response so as to prevent long term harm.
There are a number of devs who’ve reached out to me to express gratitude (on behalf of themselves and friends who have too much to lose by speaking up in support) for creating a climate in which people can finally address huge problems that have been plaguing the industry for years. Those range from misogyny, to the oppressiveness of cliques, to nepotism between journalists and devs, to the growing gap between the ideals of producers and consumers.
The scene has been really fucked up for a long time, and it’s really only been getting worse. People have noticed, but there’s never been a call to arms. Now it has a call to arms.
Mind you, I specifically wanted to avoid this particular situation, because the risk to reward ratio seemed unfavorable by my estimates. But in retrospect, extensive repair in the wake of extensive damage was inevitable.
Retrospect has a way of doing that, though.
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not sure how I directly respond to the most recent message (no reply button thingy), but i wanted to agree with you about Bentham. He is definitely too simplistic, but the idea that you can actually calculate value with literal mathematical equations is appealing from an objectivist standpoint. But, of course, there are so many problems defining value that way. For one, it seems like it would be impossible to actually calculate every person (and animals) pleasure/pain when considering how to act in a particular situation. For me personally, I think I tend to combine a duty ethic with a virtue ethic. That sounds a but messy, but ethics in practice usually is.
In any case I appreciate you taking the time to actually justify your positions and the action you took. I also appreciate how this has created an environment to discuss these issues. Until this happened, I honestly had no idea how shoddy the whole gaming journalism scene is given the massiveness of the industry. The amount of personal details revealed in this post may not be to my liking, but important conversations are now being had that weren’t before. I’m not going to lie, though, this was a riveting story.
I wish you the best of luck going forward, and I think you should get your writing out there more. Write more on games, philosophy and Wittgenstein, whatever. That’s good stuff.
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“As for what she tells me, it convinces me to give the relationship another chance.”
Uhh… what??
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I am keeping this secret.
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pregnancy is my guess
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Can’t say much that hasn’t already been said. I’m sorry for you becoming a victim of emotional and psychological abuse, and obviously used. I’m also sorry to see all the things that have resulted from this, including the slanderous idea that you are leading a misogynist crusade, and articles written by obviously biased and corrupt news outlets pinning you for others’ bad deeds. Those things aside, I hope you rise above this successfully in the future. Good luck to you man.
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I’m really curious: If you are convinced (or at least feel certain) that this girl cheated on you five times, is perfectly content with lying to you with no remorse (and has obviously been doing so since you met her– and probably longer), is less concerned with her relationship than her immediate gratification, etc., what in the world would ever possess you to decide to give “the relationship” another chance??? It’s the one part of all this that didn’t make sense.
Her being a sociopath is understandable (some people are just broken); You not picking up on it is understandable (most people aren’t sociopaths, and someone who is especially trusting could miss things). But once you realized what was going on, there wasn’t anything to build any sort of relationship on. Exactly what would make you want to continue so much as association with someone so screwed up?
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If you’re referring to the gchat conversation — I’m keeping that a secret for her sake. But it was something that made me feel like I had a responsibility to.
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I’ve been wondering this myself. This blog and your comments to the users contradict each other. You say it isn’t about her cheating on your and that it doesn’t bother you that much, but you start off pointing out that she cheated on you with several men and went on to name each one. If it had not bothered you like you claimed, you would not have felt the need to name them. Yes, she exhibits classic traits that would have been a warning for those who were looking, but you too exhibit classic traits of being submissive. Compulsive liars only care about self gratification and themselves, but this blog is just giving her more gratification because it has now made her the center of attention, so in warning people you are just stroking her ego more. Further evidence of you being submissive is the fact that you are still in contact with her after all you have shown her doing to you.
This blog strikes me as a revenge blog rather than an informative blog. Due to the history you have shown, it makes this whole blog come across as a “she broke my heart by cheating, so I’m going to air her shortcomings and issues for everyone to see”. Even your justifications of wanting to warn people show that this is guided, at first, by revenge because someone with a clear mind would have never thrown her sexual partners out there. Now, you are justified in wanting to tell the man’s wife as she should be told about her husband’s cheating, but the burden of telling doesn’t fall on you rather it was on her husband and you ex-girlfriend because it puts you in a very dangerous spot where the wife could have done a number of things including being mad and seek revenge by sleeping with someone else to get even (the someone else could have been you, just adding to the fire).
Other problems that show you have an unhealthy outlook on this and need to distance yourself from her and this blog is the fact that this blog is your attempt to police her future relationships using the self justification that you are protecting others from being treated like you were. Problem is, for every five you save there are ten more rushing to get a chance to be with her.
You have done right by showing her questionable business ethics and showing proof of not being a standup person that way. This will affect her career as some have said because the more companies know she can’t be trusted the fewer will want to hire her for jobs (look at the fallout of the group that she said a few bad comments about and they are still trying to get out from under it, this blog is just doing the same thing to her…karma). Unfortunately, this will affect your career too because you will be seen as a whistleblower and, sadly, companies distance themselves from whistleblowers to protect any possible outing of questionable ethics or practices.
My advice to you would be to break off all contact with her or run the risk of finding yourself being put through this all over again. Compulsive liars have no remorse and will never be truly sorry for what they have done. She will continue to use you for her self gratification until you wise up and leave her, then she will move onto the next person. Any remorse she shows is just an act that she has likely perfected from watching other’s emotional cues. I would also advise removing the cheating remarks, as those really are a private matter between you and her (and not the entire internet) and make this blog’s sole focus on pointing out her flawed ethics and lies in the game industry (where she seems to be doing more harm).
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Unfortunately, the portrait being painted makes no sense without the cheating part. As her hypocrisy in a wide range of realms all ends up orbiting around that. The point is to paint a portrait. And in any case, given the speed at which she goes through relationships, it’s better that people are aware of her.
As for naming the people she cheated on me with: I’m curious as to your analysis for why I censored the names of the people she failed to inform me she slept with while her and I were on break?
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Your reply again tells me you did this out of revenge. You censored, by your own admission, the two that you don’t have any bad feeling for because you believe it was during the time you and Zoe were separated, but named the ones you have bad feelings for due to it being during your relationship with her. Your censor was poorly done in the end because if they use those usernames elsewhere then a few minutes searching would reveal their names too. You even use the descriptive words sleezy and slimy to describe the parties involved which are good signs that you started writing this while the wounds were still fresh.
You could have easily painted this portrait of her without ever naming names outside of her name. For example, “Zoe Quinn, my ex-girlfriend, cheated on me with several people while we were going out. Since this is a blog about her and her questionable behavior I won’t name those she was with as it has no bearing on her behavior. One was her boss, another was a reviewer for …, etc.” You could have then blurred the names and showed her admitting to cheating on you, as well as stealing your headphones, etc. You can expose her as a cheater without revealing the men she slept with because it is more on her then the men because she could have and should have said no if she was serious about being with you.
You did everything right except where you named them because knowing who she slept with has nothing to do with what kind of person she is. She could have slept with someone famous and that would still having nothing to do with her behavior. Your evidence shows she is a compulsive liar as well as a thief and the interview you posted recently shows she can’t be trusted in the industry.
The last issue I’ve had is more with the others that have commented saying you are bringing up the corruption in game journalism, but I don’t see it that way. My children play games regularly and I’ve read many reviews that admitted to being flown to the developer’s place, getting gifts and food, then playing the game to write the review for. The corruption is obviously there, it just depends on if you consider it appropriate or not. For example, I’m not in the game industry, but I do know a few aspiring indies that are dating game reviewers as well as a couple of reviewers that are married to those who develop games. You want corruption, some publishers and developers are shareholders in some of the companies that run the review sites and used to be visible by the fact that the site theme would change to a specific game until its release. Don’t get me wrong, you did expose her for sleeping with a reviewer, but there is no proof that they were having the affair when he called her game “thoughtful” so you can’t argue corruption. Sleeping with her boss can be argued as corruption as we don’t know what favoritism he is showing her over the rest of his employees.
She is obviously a compulsive liar, but sleeping with so many men while being with you and doing so carelessly tells me that she also has an unhealthy craving for the affection of men at any cost, even her own health. You stated that she claimed she got a test done for STDs, but never showed you the results. You need to cut all ties to her and move on with your life, but keep this going with up to date news proving her questionable behavior and remove the names of the men she slept with as it has nothing to do with her behavior. All you can do is continue to point out her bad behavior and hope people listen, but there is nothing you can do to stop her behavior because she has to want to stop in order to do it. This is an addiction like mentality and she will continue to do it until she feels like she has hit rock bottom before she bothers getting proper help with it. If you continue to stay in touch with her she will eventually drain you emotionally until you are a shell of your former self so again I implore you to cut off all communication with her before it is too late.
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I’m not sure what you’re referring to when you say
“Your censor was poorly done in the end because if they use those usernames elsewhere then a few minutes searching would reveal their names too”
I didn’t reveal their usernames or anything. I just assigned them code names.
Among other reasons I named the people I named because minimally they acted as a a way to evidence my claims. One of which being the extent to which Zoe mixes personal and professional relationships. I will also admit that I put “kotaku-writin” as an adjective for Nathan because it allowed me a goal post to move discussions in positive directions if shit hit the fan.
As for Zoe, I appreciate your concern, but I don’t intend to ever speak to her again.
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Oh, when I read it and saw “Blue and Turquoise” and reference to the jigsaw list so I had assumed it was nicknames they went by rather than code names you gave them. Still, that brings me back to my point that you could have used code names for them too, blurred their names or quoted parts of the texts using the code names like you did with Blue and Turquoise rather than using their real names. You could have easily used a code name and still used the “kotaku-writin” adjective. If Kotaku cared to address it they then could have contacted you privately and taken care of the matter without dragging one of their employees and their company down with Zoe (or you could have contacted the company directly and reported him). Sites all over are questioning the legitimacy of the investigation done by Kotaku into the review he did on her game and now think the company is just covering up for him. Though, the thing I don’t understand is how him calling her game “thoughtful” is considered a good review.
You could have approached this from a different angle, still warned everyone about Zoe and her behavior, been clear about all aspects of it and still kept everyone else safe. I have my concerns about the safety of the others because we know that Zoe got death threats. My concerns are that Nathan, his fellow co-workers and bosses may be getting their fair share of threats due to so many thinking they are covering for Nathan, as well as Robin, Joshua and possibly his wife just for staying with him after all this information breaking. This is my biggest driving force for pointing out why you should have used code names for everyone except Zoe to offer them some protection.
I find myself not blaming the men she slept with because I’ve noticed a few times she mentioned it happened when they were drunk ( or maybe it was just multiple references to the same incident). Since she is a compulsive liar and obviously craves attention from men, you should consider the very real possibility that she gets them drunk to lower their inhibitions and then seduces them.
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Isnt it obvious? Threat of self-harm, if he leaves her.
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I’ve read the whole thing, and I have read most of the comments. And I remember being you.
I too loved a woman who is as you’ve described here, and I was hurt in a very similar way. I don’t know Zoe, and I know there is a lot more than we all can see, so I can only really comment on the woman you have depicted.
I can’t really find any reason to say you should not have done this, because I wanted desperately to have an outlet for the incredible pain from my experiences. What I can say is that, if I had something like this describing the one who hurt me before I met her, it would absolutely have made no difference. That is how terrifying these people can be; one can have all the evidence at hand, and still be swayed by soothing words, endearing traits, and splendid commonality. She assuaged my emotional inadequacies, and ultimately exploited them.
Based on my experiences, and what I have seen here, I don’t doubt that she had some measure of love, as she knows it, for you. From what I have read in the comments, most people don’t understand compulsion, or more specifically compulsive liars. They are not switches, responding in a binary way to input with deceptive output. They are not characters in the classic logic puzzle of liars and truth tellers. Rather, the lies are often a result of fear, and appear almost automatically in response to some perceived threat; being caught in a previous lie, being thought of as wrong or inferior in some way, and more. Sometimes there is truth told by compulsive liars. So, while she may have had love for you, I believe her compulsions and deceptive nature were so ingrained that they polluted your relationship from the start, and her fear of that happening made it worse. She is damaged, and has damaged you.
It took me ten years to finally give up holding on to my Zoe in some way. So many times I said goodbye, only to wait until she responded. I called her out, only for her to respond that I was right and she was garbage. So many of the very same words and behaviors I have read here were used in our conversations. I was weakened for so long, but I became strong. Please do not take years to do the same. There is, in the end, only one adequate response to people like this.
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Red Flag #1: “facebook official”, you guys are 12
Red Flag #2: Returning to a cheating sociopath, wtf
Red Flag #3: ” I loved you. You were my first”, you guys are 12
Red Flag #4: you guys are 12
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“facebook official” was a joke.
The rest are all entirely fair.
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From a few things you say I bet we have virtually nothing in common, but no one deserves being treated like you were. That is some messed up sociopath type shit, manipulative, excellent at lying, good at feigning emotions, checks all the boxes.
At least you seem to be able to take a bit of humor at a painful situation.
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Wow. This is like a crazy ass snapshot of the ex I spent 7 years with. Anymore I just feel sorry for the guy she married, I know she’s doing exactly the same shit to him as she did to me. Get over it, move along, there are decent people out there of both sexes. Peace brother.
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Man, reading this, I felt like I was reading my last relationships story, save all the gaming industry connections.
Her stances, the head games, the lying – all of it.
For me, her reasoning was that a “previous lover damaged her, and when I did some things, such as question her, it reminded her of him, and set in motion her doing the same kinds of things to me that she was doing to him.” and “When someone distrusts me, it makes me distrust them.”
I truly hope you start feeling better – I don’t wish this kind of mess on anyone.
Word to the wise – if you’re dealing with a woman who is starting to act this way – bail. Save yourself some heartache. She’s only manipulating you as far as she can to keep you blinded from the truth.
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If you were my own son or friend, I would seriously tell you to pull this down. Someday, you will meet someone else, hopefully be good to her and trust again, and you won’t want her paranoid anything she messages you will someday become public. That said, I’m sorry for your pain.
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I appreciate the sentiments. And i think, anyone who dates me, would have to be the kind of person who understands why this had to be done, and so would not be the kind of person who would even have to worry about it being done to them.
If it serves to ward off people who intend to behave this way though, then so be it.
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I’ve been reading Snakes in Suits and re-reading this, I think it might be safe to say that Zoe Quinn is a psychopath. Psychopaths look at people in terms of value and only target people who are beneficial to them. So ostracizing you because it isn’t worth the risk doesn’t sound surprising.
http://prezi.com/daagdyofghpd/snakes-in-suits-case-study/
I mean, of course, everyone has some sort of bias but considering that he’s been contacted by a number of people who have told him what she’s done to them or friends and considering what the Fine Young Capitalists said, I think it’s pretty safe to say that said person has some sort of condition. Please also note that psychopaths and sociopaths are NOT mentally ill. It is not the same thing.
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So?
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I didn’t know that this blog entry was still online (I thought you had taken it down) so I’m just reading the whole thing down. I’m struck by two things which I’ll share:
1) In your depiction, Zoe sounds like any person who is cheating. There is lying and deception. This is how someone who is trying to hide a big secret does to avoid having to confront themselves (or you) with their infidelity. I don’t think she was exceptionally manipulative, she sounds like other cheating partners of friends who have shared their stories with me. I think it is telling that you have such animosity towards her but seemingly no bad feelings for toward the men, some of whom you knew, who she cheated on you with. In fact, you don’t say a negative thing about them! I wonder if, in your mind, cheating is more understandable when men do it than when women do it. It takes two people to cheat and they are equally culpable but you don’t hold them responsible for any of the things that happened. Sure, your partner had more duty to be faithful but these guys knew you were together and they didn’t respect your relationship and you’re not even mad at them.
2) And in that light, I can’t believe how calm you are, both in your text messages to Zoe and in your recounting of your relationship. It shows almost a clinical detachment. Here she is, lying to you, telling you she cheated, and you are trying to make a rational response and inquire further to “get new information”. This is not how a person who is in love acts when they discover they are betrayed…they are hurt, angry, full of grief. But you interrogate her as if you are a lawyer or therapist, trying to get to the truth of what happened. It is a clinical response, not a passionate response. While I don’t condone lying to one’s romantic partner, it looks like Zoe was seeking something wild and adventurous rather than secure and steady.
While I think posting this blog post was an enormous mistake and the grief she has faced is disproportionate to what she did to you, you two were clearly in different places and sought out different things in a relationship. Despite the frequent “I love you”s, your relationship was not built to last, through no fault of either of you. As to statements of her character, I’d have to know her before I agreed with your assessment.
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1) Well that’s certainly a new one. Mostly I’ve gotten a lot of flack for naming the guys she cheated on me with, because apparently it means I must have been very mad at them. People saw that decision as vindictive. That said, I didn’t say anything too negative about them because I don’t know that there is anything to negative about them to say. They had sex with my girlfriend, and that’s shitty, but it’s not like they marketed themselves to the public and everyone they knew as the type of person who believed far too strongly in their ethical principles to do something like that.
As for the argument that “this is behavior typical of anyone who is cheating.” I think you have it backwards. What turns out to be the case, is that anyone who exhibits these behaviors (both in and out of relationships) is more likely to be the type who would cheat. That is, they are emotionally abusive, and for whatever reason, driven to control people.
Since the blog is written in the context of my relationship, there’s very little information contained herein about how manipualtive and dishonest she is generally. But if you want better sense of that, google for Mallorie Nasrallah’s post about her.
2) Yes. It is certainly a very clinical response. And there is good reason for that. It is also a large part of the reason why I’m not angry at the guys.
http://antinegationism.tumblr.com/post/98695179336/how-to-be-based-sangfroid-and-levelheaded-as-you-blow
Here is a link to Mallorie Nasrallah’s post. If you really think it was just a matter of us being “in different places,” then I don’t know that she’s in a place where anyone at all would want to go.
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About your “clinical detachment”, the sense I got is that for quite a bit of the ordeal you were looking for some way to get everything out in the open to try to salvage the relationship, less a dispassionate approach more of attempt to find some way to keep a relationship that really only existed to you.
And to Liz saying it sounds like anyone who is cheating, most people when caught tend to come clean, Zoe seem to try to continue to lie at every step, in a pretty pathological way. Quite frankly it seems like she build the entire relationship with lies, you weren’t her first relationship, and she is old enough she already knew what she is like, which is why she started out everything by stressing how honest and faithful she is as a person, she built up a persona that would inspire doubt anytime you suspected her actual actions.
And the whole instinct to blame the other party for the cheating rather than the person that had made commitments to you is just silly, they weren’t your best friends, or your brothers, the sense I got was they were acquaintances, the amount of betrayal is far greater from her. While a person the knowingly gets involved with a person in a relationship is a crappy person, being mad at the “home-wrecker” rather than the partner that violated the trust in the relationship is just dumb.
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Not sure about #2 Liz. I went through a very similar experience years ago and I did respond exactly as this young man did. I clinically probed for information, was repeatedly lied to, etc. I was so wired to trust that it was difficult to concentrate and respond when processing what I knew was a lie. So I’d take a few minutes, reevaluate what I knew, and then calmly try again. It’s amazing how someone you trust can confuse you in short bursts even when you know better. It’s like a fugue state that you are aware is happening but you can’t fully prevent and you need to take a minute to summon the facts to mind again. But for weeks I was very calm and meticulously went through the same process as this man. Though I loved her and I was incredibly stressed out in every other sense. When I first discovered the evidence I had a panic attack so severe that I immediately fell down and couldn’t breathe. I briefly suspected i’d had a heart attack and took some aspirin.
As for the author, I wish you the best and don’t blame you at all because I was you.. I once read that infidelity ranks around the level of rape in terms of the immediate psychological trauma inflicted. No doubt you’ve suffered a trauma. I’m much older than you and can safely report that the years will eventually reduce it to a footnote in your mind. Maybe once you’re ready you’ll take it down. She just won’t rate any interest from you given time.
To any young people who read this my advice is this: Listen very carefully to people’s histories. This might be one of the most important moments in your life and they are giving you the clues as to how to proceed. The details are important so tune into them carefully.
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You deserve a better girl than her.
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I think you hit mission accomplished. You paid her back 10 fold for all the hurt and pain she put you through. I’ve seen your dirty laundry and it is no cleaner than hers. You caused the basement trolls of #gamergate to seek her out and you have warped public opinion of her for her LIFE. Even if she does a 180 from what you describe, the internet may as well be laid in stone. So yes, you disgust me more than her. To your credit, I believe you both have a lot of soul searching to do.
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It’s fine if I disgust you. So long as you’re not under any delusions about her.
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Nobody should have to suffer the consequences of their own actions because it might cause others to think differently of them..? You’re talking nonsense, friend.
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This is the most horrible thing I have ever read. Just because se treated you bad you think you have the right to put her life, and who she slept with on the internet. This is just another form of revenge porn and she should sue you. You are a horrible, self centered, small and patethic person. You are also a criminal. You make me sick.
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Yes, I think a public figure’s hypocrisy is something to talk about on the internet.
No, I don’t think I have any obligation to be concerned with my abuser’s well being.
No, it’s not revenge porn, as there is nothing sexually explicit here.
No, nothing about this is illegal.
No, you haven’t understood the point of this at all.
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you have a heart of gold and i hope you find happiness someday. you’ve been so patient and kind with someone undeserving. please take care of yourself so you can heal.
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Please tell me you don’t believe her when she says the part about not knowing the guy was married. She saw opprtunity, she took it. If you plead the 5th, that’s fine (But if not, please include “I believe that …” in your response to dodge these Armchair Slander Lawyers. Don’t want them mistaking your thoughts for inclusion in facts!)
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Do you know the story of Dante Alighieri’s Divine Comedy? More precisely Dante’s Inferno. Second Circle of Inferno the lustful. The lustful in hell are “carnal sinners who subordinate reason to desire” It’s a religious work but still it has some very solid points about human nature
What I mean is that she is not socio/psychopath, she is not mentally sick. By the general standards she is not even very cunning. Just naive and lost. It’s very clear that she was dissociating from the facts. It’s a form of self deceiving. That’s why you could talk her into a dead end where she had no real answers to you anymore. Her brain was literally trying to protect herself from the painful facts and no, it does not stop by talking. This kind of brain activity will lead to almost certain depression.
I would have to say that this publication has really backfired and badly, however if you want to be famous you have to be ready for public scrutiny. I know what a pain the first real love can be, but you handled that like a pro. You deserve something much better than someone who just wants to fuck around.
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I am sorry your relationship went so wrong. I am reading your blog nearly a year after it was written, so I hope you have regained your footing and are well on your way to finding happiness elsewhere.
My father was born in the Faeroe Isles, and he was fond of sharing with me a sentiment that is commonly held there – “No deed should be done, if knowledge of the deed would bring you shame.” It appears Ms. Quinn has many deeds of which to be ashamed. It is a good thing you did by revealing this would-be exemplar for the manipulative, ambitious liar that she is. It’s unfortunate that her association with some good initiatives might have besmirched their validity.
Additionally, I very much enjoyed your writing – it is eminently readable and quite humorous. You should be doing it professionally, if you are not.
Cheers,
Varg
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How can there be so many people, even people who are fully aware of what happened between the two of you, be defending such a horrible woman? I’m sure it can be considered childish to put this all out there, not that I’d agree, but it isn’t WRONG. If there’s a chance that anyone getting close to that scumbag sees this and rethinks their decision, good. I know I’m a bit late to all of this and ultimately one more person supporting you isn’t going to change anything, but I do want to let you know I’m on your side here. You are in the right, don’t ever doubt that for a second. I hope things are going better for you now and, as petty as it surely is, much worse for her.
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Reading this was like reading my own story. The lesson or takeaway I got from dealing with a similar situation:
Abused women can be the ultimate manipulators:
Now, Zoe is self-described as being “damaged/broken/ect” and I feel sorry for her:
That being said… It’s easy to get tangled in their web of deception from women such as this. Any Psyche professor will tell you the abused often abuse others. It’s clear from the messaging that Zoe was mentally abusing the author. His gender does not disqualify him from being able to be mentally abused by a woman.
I hope the author can move on like I am. It’s a long road..
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Jeez, almost everything she says seems calculated and insincere, as though she is constantly thinking about what she’ll gain or achieve from each sentence. Seemingly a professional victim too. Talking about her past issues to try and justify her actions. Correct me if i’m wrong but she’s now featuring in books and movies? In which she’ll portray herself a victim in her one sided version about receiving hate and shit? I don’t even know if that’s right, never heard of her until today, hence me being here. But if that’s the case then it’s pretty clear that she’s more than willing to suck up any abuse/hate for success/money otherwise she’d avoid the spotlight instead of stepping further in to it. Seems like she has now manipulated the situation in which she has been a completely foul person to benefit her massively!
Easy for me to judge without having ever met her i suppose, but then it sounds like it would equally difficult to do so in person or even in a close relationship with her. Either way, nice article/blog bro, fully deserved to be put on blast. I expect you’re more than over it by now but my feelings go out to you all the same, it sure is shitty being lied to by someone you want nothing more than to believe.
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Dude I feel so sorry for you.
You will be watching in a couple of months Scarlett f’in Johansson portraying Zoe, an innocent little girl, who put it up against the evil patriarchy and was abused and raped and mistreated and everything… but in the end, she overcame all these problems, because she is a better person, a moral person.
I’d wan’t to kill my self if the movie actually comes out.
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Please do not kill yourself, it’s just a movie.
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Sorry you went thru this. Hope your doing better now.
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Hi dude. I just want to say that it is incredibly good of you that you leave this info up here. I was researching about #GamerGate and Zoe Quinn and she almost got to me! I was watching her cry on BBC and I was thinking, “Well, that looks genuine…”. She is so good at this game! I never want to make a biased or uninformed conclusion, and no one else should either. After reading this (completely, not just the TL; DR versions, I now understand couple of things:
1. My thoughts on journalism have been reaffirmed. They do not have even the slightest idea of what objectivity is.
2. Zoe Quinn has played everyone, and it is completely possible and in fact quite easy for a person to do that in this world.
Which is why I am immensely grateful that you shared this. Peace and may the force be with you.
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Alright, since I am covering the bloody awful #GamerGate for a college course, I am going to reply to your post. What you did posting this was wrong. What Zoe Quinn did was wrong, and honestly, she doesn’t seem like a good person, and I hope she ends up getting help. But the fact that she received death threats, and had to move because she didn’t feel safe at home anymore is not okay. You spawned a movement that was initially created in order to make Quinn’s life a living Hell. That is on you, and you alone. Even though she hurt you, and she did outright disgusting things to you, you should have been the better person. You didn’t post this to protect anyone. You posted it out of pure spite, and frankly, I hope you feel like shit, and that you apologized to Zoe. Never, and I mean never, post something on the internet that could cause someone’s life to become in jeopardy. It makes you the asshole.
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In terms of your school project, perhaps reading some of the other comments might help if you’re trying to sketch out a sense of why this post resonated.
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As someone who went through a similar relationship with a different woman I would say I think attributing the intent to “make Quinn’s life a living Hell” is misguided. Having had your entire understanding of reality smashed by someone, once you’re free you want to protect others from making the same mistake because you know how easy it was to make.
The method you choose may not work, may have no hope of working, but you do what you can. Here, a small blogpost ended up getting international attention because there were some aspects of gaming journalism in it. This led to those unrelated to the problem making death threats and many other egregious things but none of that is on “thezoepost”. How could he have predicted that the backlash would be that broad?
Hindsight is 20/20 but try to picture this from the point of view of someone who just got out of a relationship this abusive. Before anyone cared about you as a public entity.
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Hey Anthony. That’s like saying Nietzsche is responsible for the holocaust. Zoe Quinn isn’t some confused girl. She is a sociopath and a hypocrite of the highest order. The reason Zoe Quinn got shit on is because of Zoe Quinn. You are a fucking idiot, and what’s truly, maddeningly infuriating is that you feel so comfortable being such a fucking idiot. Spare everyone your child’s-mind feelings regarding a situation you can’t begin to wrap your head around.
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So… you think it justifies you to tell someone what is wrong or right and that they are an asshole because of a “bloody awful” “college course”? What is wrong and right is subjective and I personally think that Mr. Gjoni had serious balls to be this honest and spend this much time to lay it all out for everyone to read.
And shouldn’t you be reading the whole story if its for your course? Why are you even in the TL;DR section? Trying to get the easy way out while trying to project your opinion really makes your argument (if you can call it one) one dimensional, not to mention hilarious; I hope you got a shitty mark. (Though I’m just being spiteful)
Just for your information, this was probably very healthy for him to lay it all out, not just for us to read, but for himself to chronologically document the storm that just happened in his life so that he can understand what exactly happened in order to cope, heal, and ultimately (and most hopefully) move on from this nightmare.
Everything is about perspective. Although it was wrong of the internet/people to give death threats to ZQ, it does not make someone to share their story an asshole.
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“You spawned a movement that was initially created in order to make Quinn’s life a living Hell.”
As someone who was there when all this started I’d like you to know how very wrong you are. The movement spawned from the fact that Quinn shined a light on wizardchan because they disliked her ‘game’ leading to her and her followers raiding the place in revenge. To quote one particular wizard discussing why they were targeted, and why other places saying the same things were not, “I think, it’s like with dogs. For some reason, dogs attack the weakest member of the pack. We are not bad bad according to higher moral principles, but we elicit that instinctive reaction.” This is why she was put under a microscope to begin with.
Her links to Gawker were already being scrutinised before this blog was posted, just like her various other activities (TheFineYoungCapitalists, Pepsi Game Jam, exploiting dead people to promote her game). All this blog did was provide more context for what people were already looking at, and this isn’t the only blog to have done that; in our age of the internet when someone is a shitty person there will always be people online pointing out that they’re a shitty person and explaining why. If all people had to go on was this one blog there wouldn’t have been enough traction for a movement to begin with. You’re looking at it from a perspective almost two years later after reading Gawker controlled narratives which naturally paint them as good guys and her as nothing but a victim, and it’s easy to fall into that trap, but the simple fact is if this blog never occurred the same series of events would have played out after one of the other many people she’s hurt stepped into the light. Hate the Gate if you want, but don’t pin all the blame on one man who just wanted to share his pain.
And remember, all people are equal, but some people are more equal than others.
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Fuck you Anthony.
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Having just sat through and read all of this I’d like to thank you for making this public. It’s given tremendous insight about both myself and my past relationships, I wish I could write half as eloquently about my own troubles. Cheers dude.
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Eron Gjoni is gross and horrible.
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omfg I love this I am putting this in like every friggin place I can online so people can read it. Dude. The bad thing is… well, welcome to reality, and, well, seriously, you’ve probably been through it more than a time or two if you think about it. You just didn’t notice it. Kudos and, kick ass job of not being a puss about it and opening your mouth.
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Let me just throw in my two cents… I came to this blog after the reading the article on MSN today. I have to say that I was appalled by the backlash Zoe has received and totally expected hate Eron with all the passion I could muster for a total stranger. However, after spending my entire workday (when I wasn’t doing actual work) on this site I can totally understand Eron’s need to vent and find some understanding and possibly, finally, some closure to this situation. While I still completely disagree with the lengths internet bullies go to in order to make a stranger’s life hell, I can empathize with a man in love with a clearly unstable, neurotic, passive aggressive liar who led him on for months. I hope within all this madness, Eron, you have finally found some peace.
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I stumbled upon this while cruising the net and I was quite shocked after reading through it all. I too, have suffered greatly from this kind of infidelity. The manipulative and dishonest kind, that makes you question yourself and your value as a human being. It’s very destructive to the psyche of the victim. It’s taken me many years to value myself again after going through this and even with healing, I am forever changed. I have an extremely difficult time getting close to anyone and I often withdraw and isolate when a relationship presents itself for fear of getting hurt. Trust is difficult for me, being told all these things and manipulated into believing them will cause a person to become this way.
One observation I have made through my experiences Eron is that when you are a good person and treat the person you love with the utmost care and concern, they don’t want to lose you despite their indiscretions. They can’t let you go because you are too important to them. All of those who had done this to me, tried very hard to win me back. It made no sense to me but throughout the years I have come to understand it better. It is often the nicest of guys who are treated in this manner. We are forgiving, loving and devoted. How someone can be unfaithful despite caring so much for someone however, is a true mystery to me and it is a question I simply do not (Or likely ever) have the answer to.
I wanted to send this message along to you and hopefully anyone else who may be suffering, that you are not alone. It hurts, very very much and while not all relationships are the same, nor are our feelings the same for each individual person. It can effect us in similar ways. Putting my pain and feelings down on paper worked really well for me when I was hurting and I am sure this felt therapeutic to you as well. Best wishes to finding peace and in your healing Eron.
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I have to disagree with making this page. I sympathize I really do, I was subjected to something pretty much along the same lines. Constantly being told it’s all in my head, as much as I hate her and would like to make their life hell, I choose not to because I want to be better than that. I know it’s not fair or right, but you need to be better than that.
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Oh my god, I’d heard of gamergate, but mostly tried to stay out of it. I had no idea that a story this awful was “behind” it. This is terrible dude. That was emotional manipulation at its finest, and apparently she’s a master at it. This would be a perfect case to use in a school setting to describe all the different techniques that abusers use… she seems to know _all_ the tricks. I’m so sorry for what you’ve gone through — she definitely did not deserve death threats yadda yadda but that’s not your fault. I’m really glad you’ve gotten out of it, and this is a good warning for anyone else who ends up thinking maybe she’s girlfriend material, because until (if she ever does) she fixes her shit, she is not. I can’t believe people are tearing you up over this. Reading through all the ways she talked to you made me cringe, literally. Guilting you into dropping a friendship but doing it because you “wanted” to.. textbook manipulation right there. Can’t have her feeling bad in any way now can we?
I’m really glad you’ve left this page up (as you’re right, like, everywhere heavily misconstrues what actually happened. How does one fake this much stuff? like seriously?), and I hope things have/will go better for you continuing on. You genuinely sound like an amazing fellow who deserves a good significant other who isn’t going to lie to you to get away with whatever they want to do. No one deserves that but the number of chances you gave her… incredible dude. She’s an idiot to have refused to fix her problems and dump you. Some girl is going to be/should be (no idea what your relationship status is, and it’s none of my business) super happy to have you.
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I had read about Zoe Quinn before and knew she was bad, but I finally got around to reading this blog and goddang, this woman is a sociopath. I apologize on behalf for all these fake feminists who are giving Quinn a free pass for her actions (past and present). As a woman and an egalitarian, those comments are disgusting.
Quinn is a horrible person in every way, shape, and form. I don’t care who/what it was that “made” her this way. Ultimately, it’s on her to work that stuff out and not be a worthless human being, yet she’d rather play victim and hone her psychopathy instead. If Zoe Quinn wasn’t still making people’s lives Hell, then I wouldn’t feel the need the comment, but she still is so here I am.
I know it’s been years for you man, I just want you to know that I believe you, and I hope you’re doing well.
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(Long post. Leave now. Run!)
I like you. A lot. Your comment above is affirmation all is not lost for this world. Finally, someone with integrity practicing ideals and not getting warped about it. I’ve studied this stuff in school and understand what feminism is, Jenny. How it’s defined, how it’s been defined by the masses, it’s origins, it’s waves, it’s differing iterations or factions. I recently commented on it to a Tuber who was lamenting a year ago the Kathleen Kennedy “The Force Is Female” t-shirts were sexist and an example of forced diversity. His language and observations weren’t too bad for a misogynist, but I did have one problem with what he was doing. Anyway, I showed him how those shirts weren’t sexist, but how something culturally important omitted in his video was. Also found an opportunity to explain some differences between perceived or radical feminism and defined, regularly-practiced, pragmatic, egalitarian feminism pertinent to his content. Haven’t heard back from him yet and don’t expect to. I mean, how could anyone possibly keep up with posts coming full on a year later?
You’ll probably never read this, “imjusthere,” but if you do, maybe you could go over to that channel and read over my comment, relaying your thoughts about it. They’d be welcomed, as I’m not sure if I’m still up to date. Here’s the link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e45uO6pgtFw It’s the 11:55 min one entitled (oh! that’s fuunny.) “Can Star Wars Survive Kathleen Kennedy and SJW Politics?” My handle’s “Don’t Panic” on YT. I wrote a screed, but it has some fun bits.
You know, if you replied in two years like I’m doing right here now with you, that Sandra Bullock movie with the time-traveling mailbox would make a lot more sense to me. It’d be a more fun way to observe 9/11 than some. Easy to remember, too!
Anyway, good on you for such encouraging words of support to Eron. Never heard the term “fake feminists” before and I like your no excuses stance on past traumas, too. As the girls say (to use one of my least favorite words in how it’s so improperly used) “You a real bitch.” or maybe it’s “That bitch for real.” The way you put it reminded me of how “I was drunk” or “They’re not themselves when they’re drinking, so their not responsible for their actions” spiel still finds traction as a defense for abhorrent behavior. No. That excuse won’t work for a drunk driver killing a family of five with his Ford. I know this take views only a small part of the entire problem, but alcohol lowers our inhibitions like a truth serum & makes it easier for most to open up among other things like impairing motor functions. And like a truth serum, more often than not it exposes our real selves that we often actively keep hidden. It’s why there’s so much respect still held today within Irish culture when “Aye, but have you drunk with ‘im?” is asked or in the idiom, “I’ve drunk with ‘im” is used to cancel suspicion to mean, he’s alright/I vouch for him; they recognize the truths laid bare when someone’s in their cups where we Americans often deny such revelations, leading to excuses for bad behavior, magically transforming abusers into victims, resulting in leniency for acts instead of accountability It’s wierd. Just like the word “weird” is weired. Wiered.
I’ve written a book, so before I sound weirder before a p erfect stranger I know nothing about except that her brain works fine and she’s probably smarter than me ’cause she doesn’t post long rants, I’ma gonna jet. So long. Hope I hear from you and that my jokes made you laugh, as intended, and didn’t offend overly much. I should get pissed. I’d probably write better. (And I do.) With sleep dep– the all-purpose chill way to altar one’s state of consciousness, a.k.a. myfavoritedrugofchoicecuzit’slikesofree– not so much. As your words above have seemingly inspired me in some way– just look at all this literally littered verbage! Seriously?!– I bid you good day wherever and whenever you are doing whatever. However… I said good day! In all sincerity, it was nice writing you. –Douglas
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Oh God.. You are such a pathetic loser, don’t you have shame at all? You’ll die alone like the Beta you clearly are. Delete this and then yourself.
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Great. Another Quinn cultist (Quitist) (Uh. Ufph. I’m so tired of typing those words anymore. Can I get the voice operated keyboard over here, please!) another Quitist sanctioning suicide. Haven’t you learned yet? Since August the 31st (Who knows end of “The last night in August” lyric by Carol King? Amiright? You think I’m bad, wait ’til you see what she does when she hears about this!), as i say, since the 31st of August, we’ve wised up and organized our own counter revolution to your counter revolution, but we’re the counter counter (ehrm. okay, combine the two, carry the one)… we’re the Encounters. Some of us are humanists, some of us are anarchists. Some are righties and some are lefties. One is within your own sphere right now. We call him Honey Badger. Some of us are willing to cancel you and all you stand for. Some are willing to get close to you and learn all your naughty deeds. Some are using humor to combat you, as everybody gets so offended these days and it’s the easiest way to out you. No one understands comedy anyway, so you’ll never know what to do to react to being publicly shamed by it bc you won’t understand it. Reasoning that’s circular, see?. Point is, we’re coming for you. And, you just went to the top of the list with your unwarranted “go delete yourself” comment to Eron from two years ago. The internet’s stone, baby! Not stoned! Stone! Emailing….’mailing….’mailing….Though they’re disapprovin’ Keep them chaps emailing Rawhiiiiiiiiiiiide! Yep, that’s got it. ‘Expect a customer care representative to arrive at your place of business in 3-5 working days. Thank you for wearing condoms.’ Oh! His name is Ji and he’s half-Korean (and not the good half). He’s an Encounter who likes you to know he’s coming. Know the most essential thing about him– and this might save you, so pay attention. He loves America. Like a lot. He says this place is so much more fun than the oppressed place he came from– so much more opportunity. And now, you’re his! Congratulations! You’re gonna learn a lot.
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thanks for this post, it was very helpful for me and probably others who are dealing with their own borderlines.
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